Indian IT firms are heading for a fall

Response to visa-related lawsuits indicates that Indian services firms don't fully understand the American system

Patrick Thibodeau

April 6, 2012 (Computerworld)

India's IT firms understand software, but not America.

It is the American character not to back down, and to fight for what is right. Our children are taught this from their earliest ages. Even new arrivals, immigrants or people on work visas are quick to grasp this essential truth.

America's institutions reflect the national character. Our political system encourages sharp and hard contests. Our legal system facilitates a fight, as India's IT companies are now learning.

Three of India's largest IT outsourcing firms, Infosys Technologies, Larsen & Toubro InfoTech and Tata Consultancy Services, are involved in lawsuits filed against them by current and former employees.

The lawsuits are a problem for each of the companies. But taken together, the cases are a major threat to the Indian IT industry in America.

India's IT firms are dependent on American businesses for about half of their revenue. They can't operate in this country without work visas, such as H-1B and L-1 visas.

Thus the allegations by employees of visa misuse and harassment have broad implications and are attracting federal investigators and congressional oversight.


Comments (23) -

United States James
April 8. 2012 08:54

India, Inc. is finished in the US. It is now common knowledge that these people are little more than RICO-organized criminal crime syndicates. Using millions in NASSCOM/USINDPAC PR hype, they have managed to get into US companies by the MILLIONS, fake their way through, and CLEAN out on of our companies after another. They are not helping the US economy, they are here to CLEAN US OUT. And they only hire other Indians. THAT is why they lust after the visas so much. Without the visas as a conduit to get their siphoners into our companies, they HAVE NO BUSINESS MODEL. India Inc's business model consists entirely of ripping off other countries. They are unable to produce anything on their own. If these people were so brilliant they wouldn't need visa or even to come to the US at all - they'd make their own economies boom.

Game over India, you lose, we win. Don't let the door hit you in the arse on the way out.

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Kuwait Anonymous
April 8. 2012 15:23

The source or epicentre of all kinds of frauds & crimes is within India. Everyone knows how corrupt & criminalised government of India itself is. Violation of law is a given in India. Only then the plethora of lawyers can make money claiming to represent the victim. The cases drag on & on. Many middlemen also make money doing wordy paperwork. This has been the norm in India.

India's overpopulation breeds nothing but corruption spawning forth dangerous parasites. The same Indian would hesitate to transgress rules  in Arab countries as punishment is severe if caught. Unlike America that foolishly treats them as their equals.

Within India the call center employees have been making huge amount of money leading to steep increase in property prices. Where an apartment was earlier leased out to a family for a reasonable rent , it gets rented out to a few of these call center employees who are willing to pay exorbitant rent & the house owner makes a plump profit. Sudden influx of money in the hands of such immature youth also leads to alcoholism , drunken driving , drug use & many such social ills. Some  fall into the lap of faux messiahs like art of living guru SSSSRavishankars etc who siphon off their earnings & energies calling it 'seva'.

Indians are not mature people like the Westerners. They go overboard drinking & partying naming their westoxication as 'getting westernised '. Should any American take action against Indians trust Indian media to cry 'racism'. They will never own up their mistakes. But blame everything on history , Britain etc.    

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Kuwait Anonymous
April 8. 2012 15:37

Not just Indian IT firms dependent on American business for their revenue but the entire Indian film industry makes a mish mash of Hollywood movies plagiarising their music , stunt scenes & thus thriving.

Take anything for instance like cooking demonstration or some exercise. Any Westerner presenting it on youtube does an excellent job. Indian will imitate & come up with a garbled version. A letter receives a prompt reply from a Westerner. Whereas an Indian will not respond.

The most unkindest cut being India is viscerally anti America. Anything going wrong anywhere they will blame "America..AAA...AAA is behind this ".

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United States Drifter
April 9. 2012 08:11

Where are all the pro india cheerleaders now?

Americans can't keep up? Americans need to upgrade their skills? Americans are lazy? We laughed at you clowns years ago, knowing what the truth was and now it has come to pass...

Like a flash in the pan rockstar that is too irresponsible and not humble enough to recognize the reality of his success; the ride is straight up and straight down.

Nobody believes india is worthwhile or relevant now in the IT market. They don't even create anything. They had their chance to make an impact on the world market but they brought their irrepressible culture of corruption, cheating and lying with them and they blew it in spectacular fashion. It was an exceptional opportunity but not surprisingly, they didn't recognize or take advantage of it.

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United Kingdom Mr X
April 10. 2012 00:55
Mr X

Please help me. I need professional advice.
Do you think leaving programming to become a systems administrator is a good move?

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United States Viceroy Biggles
April 10. 2012 01:52
Viceroy Biggles

I just got a fake missive from, let's call her "Rita Ebayworth" (a fake name) with a fake skill matrix asking for the last 4 digits of my SSN and my day/month of birth. I filled out the matrix and declined to give this information (duh!) and surprise, no response.

I despise these scammers.


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Canada Mark
April 10. 2012 11:18

Tech Employment Myths and Facts

Myth:  Good tech employees are hard to find, interview, and hire.

Fact:  The resume queues of most firms are chock full of highly motivated and qualified individuals looking to do the jobs that are thrown at them.  

Myth:  There’s a shortage of engineers and other STEM personnel.

Fact:  The United States has twice the number of STEM personnel unemployed as it has actually working in STEM jobs.  STEM-trained individuals are often forced to perform low-value clerical and administrative tasks that, if a shortage existed, could be offloaded to other personnel with little or no STEM training.

Myth:  Tech skills become obsolete six months after a person hasn’t used them or isn’t in school.

Fact:  Not true at all, most tech skills are not of the type that become obsolete or forgotten.  An individual who hasn’t used a particular skill for a long time may need a short period to refamiliarize themselves with the particular skill.  No different than someone who has not swung a golf club for a few months, or taken a summer break from the winter recreational activity of skiing.  Even a highly experienced individual may have to spend a significant amount of time learning how their existing skill relates to the new employers' business or technical environment. There is no such thing as "hitting the ground running" in tech.

Myth:  New CS grads from US universities don’t know how to code.  I give them coding tests in interviews and they don’t even know what libraries to use!  I have no choice but to hire the foreigners because they do!

Fact:  Coding skills are an integral part of all CS curricula at US schools.  But since the field is so vast, individuals cannot be expected to remember all the minutae involving syntax, libraries, etc.  Often ‘foreign’ candidates have been coached on interview techniques by company insiders, or have been taught “coding” in the so-called ‘rote memorization’ fashion which is great for recitation, but horrible for creativity.

Myth:  Engineering and CS grads are anti-social people, not good workers for my business.

Fact:  CS grads come in all shapes, sizes, and levels of social skills.   Without calling them up and interviewing them, you cannot really tell.

Myth:  Engineering and CS/IT employees are “cost centres” of my business because they do not generate revenue nor profit.

Fact:  Try generating any profit without using computers or without having any engineered product to sell.  Think about that for a while.

Myth:  One can judge, “on the face of a resume”, whether a person is qualified for a position.

Fact:  Resumes, being text documents, cannot possibly embody all of the skillsets and personal attributes of an individual.    The only way of determining qualifications in most cases, for an individual who has the requisite degrees, is to actually have an individual in for an interview.  Especially in IT, where many skills, thought to be trivial, are not typically placed on a resume, or an individual has acquired significant experience in an area due to personal projects.

Myth:  Guest workers save my business money, they work for cheap, and when they get sick, I can deport them instead of paying huge health insurance claims.

Fact:  Guest workers consistently provide poor value for employers and the economy generally.  Over a million guest workers have flooded into the United States, creating one of the worst recessions/depressions since the 1930s.  If guest workers were so great, the economy would otherwise be booming.  Individual businesses face substantial risks of theft of intellectual property because guest workers often have multiple loyalties.  Guest workers on the H-1B visa are now suing employers who lay them off on grounds that would otherwise be prohibited.

Myth: All the top grads from the top schools have been snapped up by Google/Microsoft/Facebook and other big brand-name tech companies. Even if I could afford to pay a $100k salary, I still wouldn't be able to hire anyone. I thus have no choice but to use guest workers.

Fact: Less than 40% of the grads from top schools in CS, EE, Math, and IT, such as UC Berkeley, and Cornell, are employed, and the average salary of grads of these top schools is typically less than $80k/year. Only a handfull of individuals from either school go to those three brand-name tech firms. The other 60% of the class, without job offers, would be thrilled to see you on campus or accepting resumes through your firm's resume queue.

Myth: The tech job market is so hot right now that all the good people are taken.

Fact: High quality talent find themselves in the contemporary market drowned out in the sea of resumes. It has been said that the resume sorting system at Google is so dysfunctional that even Linus Torvalds (the famous author of the Linux Kernel) could apply for a Kernel Engineer position at Google and receive not even the courtesy of a response.  Facebook has automated the rejection process to the point where perfectly qualified candidates receive rejections within seconds after being enticed to complete a Facebook online application.  

Myth: HR tells me that the resume queues of my business for IT and engineering positions are full of people who are not qualified. 90% of the candidates we receive resumes from are merely 'spamming' their resumes.

Fact: Without reading all of those resumes, how do you really know? Individuals rarely will waste their time applying to a job for which there is no nexus between the job, and their qualifications. Very few job websites are easy enough to navigate that a resume can be submitted with the mere click of a button. And HR people are not engineers or IT people, how would they be able to properly assess qualifications if they are not even trained in the field?

Myth: The US tech industry would come to a halt if the H-1B and L-1 visas were cancelled and the individuals holding them (and Green Cards derived from them) deported. These individuals are, after all, the "best and brightest". America cannot afford to lose its "best and brightest" talent and expect to compete in the global marketplace.

Fact: The O-1 visa is the appropriate visa for the 'best and brightest', and is available in unlimited numbers to "best and brightest" job candidates. H-1B and L-1 cancellation would open nearly a million job opportunities for unemployed and underemployed STEM workers in the United States. H-1B's are typically paid at, or just slightly above the 'prevailing wage'. A wage rate that has been significantly suppressed due to a million guest workers in the United States. America can best compete in the global marketplace by putting its domestically trained engineers back to work and giving Americans priority in the job market for American jobs.

Myth: Most of the students in US universities studying science and engineering are foreigners. Therefore, to maintain a representative workforce, business must hire a large number of foreigners simply to obtain the talent they need.

Fact: 90% of the graduates from STEM programs in the United States are United States Citizens. Caucasian males, but increasingly females, are heavily represented. A 'representative workforce' of STEM workers in the United States would be comprised mostly of Caucasian males. Equal opportunity and employment diversity laws have been dealt a massive setback in the United States by technology firms primarily hiring foreign nationals from 3rd world countries in preference to qualified US citizens with massive investments in their personal education, student loan committments, etc.

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United States James
April 10. 2012 11:28

I got one of those eBay forms too - but mine was for an alleged job. AND it was an American "recruiter". I gave them data alright. But not real data ;-0

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India UselessMorons Americans
April 10. 2012 21:01
UselessMorons Americans

USA is going down , its a sinking ship anyways..

I feel sorry for Americans, its understandable that Americans cant digest that their women are worshipping our shafts and we are giving them kids while impotent drunk american idiots cant even manage anything on their own

By 2045 russian population will decline by 70 percent

European population will decline by around 58 % with 1,42 birth rate

We will become dominant race and dominate whole world and will become ultimate rulers of whole world

No one can deny this ,or challenge our position

We are here to stay and give children to your women

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Canada ezygoer
April 11. 2012 11:51

Indian IT can only fall when Corp. America stops handing over contracts to them which is not possible as how will the easy money train then chug on ?

Can the US enact laws for outsourcers to hire only Americans for the contracts handed over to them ? Not likely as they will hit the wall with the usual con by Corp. American lobbyists - not enough local talent or the terrible shortage of STEM workers etc.

How will IBM then make money ?

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India UselessMorons Americans
April 11. 2012 18:18
UselessMorons Americans

india is sole superpower on this earth and we are unchallangeable --in 50 years from now half of the worlds population is indian and we are sole rulers of this world

for that matter entire universe ..

Since early ages Indians are always above rest of human race..

Infact we are descendants from another planet with highest IQ and we are powerful race than rest of humanity

Sooner or later we will dominate all the world and rule this world with iron fist

We are superpower, it doesnt matter what you think--you  have to accept this fact and live with it

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United States Drifter
April 11. 2012 23:26

LOL - Troll.

American women won't even go near any of you because of the reek and regular condoms are too large for you. - A survey of more than 1,000 men in India has concluded that condoms made according to international sizes are too large for a majority of Indian men - Most men's penises are an inch too short for popular prophylactics: Condoms designed to meet international size specifications are too big for many Indian men as their penises fall short of what manufacturers had anticipated, an Indian study has found.

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United States Dean
April 12. 2012 02:23

what is this O-1 visa? Is this going to be the "next" bullshit vehicle for shit-head slumdog firms ( ie. Tata, Info-Shit, CrapGemini, Wipe-Pro etc ), to bring in more morons?

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United States snowwhite
April 12. 2012 02:51

@UselessMorons Americans:

Are you a cockroach?

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United States joshua
April 12. 2012 08:33

does anybody know whatever happened to that diploma-mill
down in VA, I think it was university of north virginnia
or something? are they still around? did they get busted?
just wunderin'


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United States James
April 12. 2012 12:24

@UselessMorons Americans

Hey everybody look! Another delusional Indian!

"india is sole superpower on this earth and we are unchallangeable --in 50 years from now half of the worlds population is indian and we are sole rulers of this world"

Some superpower. 600,000,000 of you are so stupid you have to take a crap on the ground everyday. India can't even build enough toilets, let alone conquer anyone. Stop dreaming it is never going to happen. You got your asses kicked by Brits, Muslims, Chinese, and just about everyone else. Most likely in 50 years you won't exist because Pakistan will have long since nuked you.

"Since early ages Indians are always above rest of human race.."

If you are above the rest then why haven't you even been able to build adequate sewers in 5000 years? LOL. Stop deluding yourself. Indians crap in the rivers until they stop flowing and then wash their clothes in the same rivers. Even animals know clean water from filth. But you don't.

"Infact we are descendants from another planet with highest IQ and we are powerful race than rest of humanity"

Average Indian IQ is 81 - borderline retard! HAHA!

"Sooner or later we will dominate all the world and rule this world with iron fist"

You ain't gonna do jack since you can't even pick up your own trash and you live in your own crap.

We are superpower, it doesnt matter what you think--you  have to accept this fact and live with it "

You ain't shit. (Actually you ARE shit). I was watching Japanese TV the other night and it was about a company that wanted its employees to go to India to train slumdogs who were brainless. No one in the company wanted to go. They all laughed at the suggestion and waved their hands saying "No way". So they ended up sending some retired 65-year old Japanese to India to train you morons. He was the only guy they could get to go to India since all the other employees know what a sewer it is and they don't want to have to breathe air that stinks like a toilet from one coast to the other for the rest of their lives.

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India WeInventedKamasutra
April 12. 2012 17:56

Moron Americans, they just waste their Sperm on condoms while we dont use them often and really satisfy your women with our holy fluid

And more over its not Size that matters, but your efficacy , american idiots watch too much porn and think thats what goes in bedroom and behave such way, most american women even think thats what sex is all about..until they have had with an indian man who gently dominates her and passionately touches her soul with his love

Thats why your women fall for us, and we dont have alcohol or we smoke much, so we have higher sperm count  than most idiotic americans

We can make more babies for same reason--its not size and average size of indians is 5,6 inches which is Normal size ....

There are more things that you can do in bed and make your partner crave for your love than inserting your shaft in her hole which is the only things americans know---thats why your marriages dont last..

Ask any american women who made love with indians--first word that comes out of her mouth moslty is ---they are caring in bed

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United States joshua
April 12. 2012 20:18

OMG! Today has started out as the best day ever!
I just woke-up and turned on the TV, and guess what!
Just caught CBS News this morning - doing a great cover story on Slumdog
outsourcing and centering their story on the JayPalmer/Infosys case!
Loved it! it ran this morning around 800am to 810am eastern time,
hope somebody can get and upload a video clip!!
I was so happy!

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United States Drifter
April 12. 2012 23:22

'It's not size that matters...'

You go ahead and keep telling yourself that. LOL

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United States Asian_H1B
April 12. 2012 23:58

I can't see my comments

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United States snowhite
April 13. 2012 08:43

"There are more things that you can do in bed and make your partner crave for your love than inserting your shaft in her hole which is the only things americans know---thats why your marriages dont last.."

Does your boss know that you write this stuff at work when you should be putting out crappy code at low-ball rates? No wonder Indian IT projects fail.

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Canada Indian Tatti
April 13. 2012 17:19
Indian Tatti

Inofsys shares down 9 % in pre - trading

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India UselessAmericanMorons
April 13. 2012 17:30

We are best in world,No one can challenge us--White american birth rate is falling, sooner or later world will succumb to Indian talent

and Only indians will dominate everything

Rest of the humanity must accept to live under our foot , this will continue for another 1000 years

So Americans must prepare 1000 Years of Indian Super status and world domination

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